Line doublers and upscalers.

Hi,

I am looking into line doublers etc to get the best possible picture out by Pioneer CLD 2950. However, are these suitable for TFT TVs? Wouldn't it be better to get a composite to HDMI upscaler, like this?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Upscaler-Up-scale-S-Video-AV-HDMI-Converter-1080P-/180652480604?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2a0fba185c

Has anyone tried this to see what happens, or do you need something more expensive?

Daniel

Just got a SCART to HDMI 720/1080p upscaler like the one mentioned before. I just testing it now- seems that colour and definition are improved, but there might be a bit more noise and there seems to be a very slight flicker. Looks promising though.

Daniel

This is exactly what I got:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280656817248&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT

The picture is very impressive indeed with loads of detail- the only weird thing is the zoom setting I used to use for scart is now distorted- the only setting which looks right now is "subtitle". This gives me unequal black bars and a slight "squash", but a really good widescreen look, which you don't get with zoom.

Cheers for keeping us updated, it's something that I've thought about trying myself but I mostly have my player plugged into a small screen so there's not much point. Every now and then I plug it into the big TV though so upscaling would be useful.

Let us know if you solve the problems you're having.

Does anyone else have any experience with this sort of thing?

Well, it looks like "subtitle" is the way to go. It's almost like the scaler is outputting to 16:10 instead of 16:9. To me, the scaler stabalises colour, improves detail and depth- I feel that the picture has an old school, vivid cinematic feel that doesn't quite happen in DVD and Blu Ray. The only downsides are the fact that the letterbox is off centre (because of the subtitles setting)- I also get a slight ghosting of horizontal lines on occasions. However, from where I am sitting, I feel that what I am getting is a distinct improvement. I have configured colour etc so that any noise is invisible from viewing distance too- the ghosting isn't really troublesome from here.

I have read that most modern TVs upscale, even if you are connected via scart- if my TV was, it was just resulting in a soft image lacking in detail. There must be a fair amount of processing going on, as the CLD 2950 processes the image, so does the upscaler AND the TV. I have a funny feeling the upscaler prepares the image to be more palatable to the TV than the original signal!!

I also guess it will depend what kind of TV you have too. Mine is a bog standard Hannspree, so I am probably having to work harder to get tidy results.

I'm now at the stage where you could sit someone down and they would be unlikely to realise that you were playing a non RGB / legacy format, which was my aim ;-)

Daniel

I have done some more research now that I have a composite cable long enough. Believe it or not, I have only tried my 2950 via Scart and S-Video. Putting composite through the upscaler was a disaster (blurry and ghosting). I never tried composite directly into the TV, because I reasoned it would be identical to Scart. However, I hadn't planned on the way the TV treats the composite signal vs scart. The TV actually switches between PAL and NTSC via the component input- through Scart, it just does CVBS (I presume pseudo NTSC when that signal is inputted?). Anyway, the end result is an amazing picture- you really can't tell it's laserdisc and more importantly, the panning is really smooth. However, on my current calibration I am getting noise in intense blues and reds (not REALLY distracting)- these weren't visible when upscaled.

I'm going to carry on playing around with all the options and report back. The advantage of upscaling is that you get the full wide screen aspect ratio (but with large unequal horizontal bars)- with composite, you have to zoom and get the edges cut off. I think I was right and the upscaler to smoothing out all the detail (hence the smooth noise free colours), like the more brutal grain removal DVD releases you get. I have also noticed if I turn off the high quality circuit, smearing (especially around faces) stops- I am leaving any sharpening to the TV now.

So, now I am thinking that turning off all features and letting the TV deal with the composite input is best. I guess that this would also suggest that a basic final generation player (e.g. CLD S315) will come up nicely- I will have to try, as I have one!!

Thanks for the information on upscaling the picture quality, Im interested to know exactly what I would need and would like it if you could give ebay links to all the items needed. Also it would be great if you were able to post pictures or videos showing the improvements.
I have very little know how when it comes to anything technical so any simple advice would be appreciated.

Hi,

OK, I have the definite results of my tests now.

The upscaler I am using is this:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Scart-HDMI-1080p-UPSCALER-Converter-Adapter-Sky-Wii-/280656817248?pt=UK_Computing_CablesConnectors_RL&hash=item4158732c60 - it's SCART to HDMI.

S-Video is no good, S-video via the upscaler is no good (weird colour artifacts), composite via upscaler is TERRIBLE.

SCART via upscaler is good- it registers as CVBS and appears to give the full widescreen aspect in "subtitle" mode. Colour is very smooth with noise smoothed out, however, the picture is soft. If I get facial blurring, I turn "HQ circuit" off. This setup means the subtitles in Star Wars are not cut off. Panning is not very smoothing for PAL or NTSC.

Composite directly to the TV is very sharp and clear, but prone to noise in heavy reds and blues (it will just about manage the T2 "blue out" comfortably, though from viewing distance). However, I think I have things set too bright at the mo, which emphasis the noise. If I get hold of a proper calibration disc, I should be able to reduce the impact of this. TV is set to zoom, which does not give the full picture width. TV swithes to PAL or NTSC as required- panning is silky smooth in both.

I think I am going to stay setup for both of the good options and switch as I see fit.

One more thing, my CLD 2950 is in the hi-fi rack across the room, so all cables are 10m- I am guessing that I may get less noise when I eventually manage to move the room around and get the player closer to the TV.

So, composite for sharp, smooth panning picture (with risk of noise), upscaler for full width picture with no noise.

I will try and get some meaningfull photos.

Daniel

Very interesting mate. I am about to dabble in Upscaling with my CLD2950 and CLD D750
At the moment I am using S Video to my Panasonic 1080P LCD TV from the player
I am noticing that S video is slightly superior to the RCA (yellow white and blue cables)
The Scart connection was tried but it really wasnt any better than the RCA composites

Companies in Australia stock an S video, Scart and RCA (all on the one box) upscaler so I really cant wait to try it